S5 E4: How to understand TikTok metrics and advertising to grow sales with Anatoliy Labinskiy (Founder, GSM Growth)


Anatoliy Labinskiy, a 4-time Two Comma Club winner and founder of GSM Growth, joins Retention Chronicles to discuss how to understand TikTok metrics and grow your sales with TikTok advertising.

Anatoliy tells Mariah and Noah about one of the biggest growth tools in ecommerce right now- TikTok shop. New products and brands are becoming relevant everyday on TikTok, and that’s just from organic media.

Anatoliy and his team have mastered the paid media side of TikTok and are here to share tactical takeaways all brands can implement. TikTok is a great platform to bring eyeballs to your brand and after that brands can hit up retargeting ads to capture the attention of potential buyers.

But, TikTok has less consistent growth than Meta, and so you have to know the right approach and metrics to track. Anatoliy walks through how to ensure you're remaining profitable on TikTok.

Anatoliy also addresses the concerns of some that the platform will decrease in popularity or cease to exist.

Episode Timestamps:

  • E-commerce marketing strategies and personal life updates. 3:32

  • TikTok as a retention channel for e-commerce brands. 6:49

  • TikTok advertising success stories. 11:36

  • TikTok marketing strategies and profit margins. 16:11

  • TikTok ad campaign optimization using A/B testing. 20:33

  • TikTok advertising strategies and budget management. 30:00

  • TikTok ad optimization strategies. 35:35

  • TikTok metrics to track. 42:01

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This transcript was completed by an automated system, please forgive any grammatical errors.


creatives, tick tock, campaign, metrics, scaling, breakeven, budget, ad, working, started, profitability, testing, ctr, tic tock, episodes, cpa, tik tok, account, agency, platform


Noah Rahimzadeh, Anatoliy Labinskiy, Mariah Parsons

Mariah Parsons 00:04

Greetings and welcome to retention Chronicles podcast with learnings from expert e commerce, brands and partners. I'm Ryan Parsons,

Noah Rahimzadeh 00:12

and I'm no Rahim today, if you're here, you're either on a quest for E commerce enlightenment, or you accidentally click the wrong link. Either way, we're thrilled you stumbled into our corner of the internet.

Mariah Parsons 00:22

And hey, even if you're not on the E commerce hype train, stick around. We promise it'll be worth your while. We've got pearls of wisdom for everyone, whether you're running a business or just trying to keep your house plans a lot. Exactly.

Noah Rahimzadeh 00:33

So before we unleash the brilliance of today's episode, let's give a shout out to our fantastic sponsor Malomo.

Mariah Parsons 00:40

They're the wizards behind the curtain, making the post purchase experience smoother than a jazz solo,

Noah Rahimzadeh 00:45

hit that subscribe button like it will increase LTV overnight, and check out our other episodes go malomo.com That's GOMALO mo.com yet

Mariah Parsons 00:55

ready for insights chuckles and possibly a profound realization or two. Here's our newest episode of retention Chronicles.

Noah Rahimzadeh 01:08

All right, I am pumped first ecosystem episode of 2024. And we're kicking off with an absolute bang. Joining us today is E commerce export expert. Wow, Anatoly Lipinski for time two comma club winner and founder of GSM growth, which is an E commerce agency. And, and totally, I'm gonna pass it over to you in just a second. But first, since this is the first episode of the year, I just wanted to say a couple words about our new format. So our listeners know what to expect in 2024. So for these ecosystem episodes, which again, are the episodes that I run, know, are huge today, here head of partnerships at Malomo. We're typically bringing on some of the top agencies and technology players in the E commerce ecosystem, to share strategy and tactics, but we're going to switch it up a little bit this year, and make these episodes much more tactical, and sort of to the point. So the goal is for our audience of agencies and ecommerce operators, to be able to have an actionable strategy or tactic that they can actually implement after listening to or watching these episodes. And on that note of watching the episodes, that's another change for the year, we'll be asking our guests to share their screens and show real examples or ideas or presentations of those strategies or tactics that they're going to be teaching us about. And then we'll upload all episodes to YouTube, as well as our normal podcast channels. And then finally, since everyone is, I think, busier than ever right now, I think we'd all agree with that. I'm hoping to make these episodes more concise so that historically they've been about an hour, we're going to try to keep them to about 30 minutes or less. And we're super excited to try out this new format and hopefully make them more actionable for our for our listeners. And with that, I'd like to introduce our guests and totally thanks so much for joining us. I'd love to kick it over to you for an intro if you could. And as part of that intro, one thing that we are keeping this year that I'm excited about is one thing that you're excited about in your personal life. So introduction and something that is exciting. You can say miami miami is always great, but feel free to switch

Anatoliy Labinskiy 03:32

it sure first of all normally I really appreciate for inviting me and I'm looking forward to share today my skills my experience what's working for us and looking forward that at least one person out there will listen make the notes and implemented and it will be already a huge win for me because this stuff is working again and again for us we're gonna be moving there a bit later. But the thing is that yeah, I'm really happy to be here and the like the short introduction that aren't agency wander org name of the agency Jason gross. And we are handling Shopify brand owners stores and the Drop Shipping stores for our clients scaling through Facebook tick tock Google and SMS email marketing for the brand owners will be we are building ecommerce advertising ecosystem. So basically starting from one platform after that they did another one and another one. So evidently, the business owner has full marketing coverage from our site where we help in visa UGC to helping with advertising SMS email marketing and guidance in general how to expand the brands. So like that's working quite well. We're doing that over four years, made multiple eight figures in the clients results and I'm in the commerce since 2017. And really obsessed with this industry like there is no sales ceiling at all like it just insane how everything is Changing, improving like adaptation every single quarter, I would say going on with some kind of new things. And what I'm excited about about the personal stuff I'm about to become second time father in couple of months. And that's the most excitement, definitely thinking my end. And we are waiting for the second son. And regarding the business, like I'm excited about 2024, like I started this year from the events related to my industry, and the things which are happening and found how much we need to implement the 2024, especially AI related, especially, like strategies for growth, not just like, not technical strategies, the growth company started those strategies, which we have to implement the next slide cuarto is just mind blowing. And like, I'm so excited for the upcoming year, because it's insanely valuable and insanely productive that we are supposed to be as for now as I can see. So that's make me excited, a lot.

Noah Rahimzadeh 06:07

Awesome. Congrats on the addition to the family that's coming very soon. I think we're, I think like 50% of the time, I'd say so yeah, it's totally unrelated. And most of the time, it's a newborn on the way right? Or recently born.

Mariah Parsons 06:26

It's a very exciting way to keep tabs with everyone of what's going on in their life. Yeah.

Noah Rahimzadeh 06:30

Yeah. And really Anatoli, this will be your third child since you run your own business. Cuz I have a second.

Anatoliy Labinskiy 06:41

Yeah, I have another three businesses. So it's like I'm a multiple, multiple child family.

Noah Rahimzadeh 06:47

Right, right, right. I'm curious. And this might, this might go into the tactic that you talk through with our audience today. But you said, you know, new things happening every single quarter in E commerce and you're really excited about some of the changes in 2024 and developments in our in our ecosystem. You mentioned AI, is there anything else that you're sort of keeping an eye on and really excited to learn more about and to implement in the new year,

Anatoliy Labinskiy 07:17

I would say that what was the really mid from middle 2023 Till today, one of the biggest things which is happening right now for the E commerce world, in our opinion, as agency owners and their several brand owners who I speak with is the Tick Tock shop, tick tock shopping just like taking over so heavily to show up from nowhere, like taking over so many like brand new products became a big brands in the last six months. So definitely like Tiktok shop, this is something what we are started implementing now to our marketing ecosystem, which we provide into the customers because like this is something which is has to be in that ecosystem. It's organic, it has a lot of brand awareness. And it just has a lot unlimited infinity quantity of the creatives, which we can use and like just scaling up with the ecommerce advertising because this will usually like a bottleneck for the any kind of ecommerce brand creatives, but with the Tick Tock shop, it just covering so many things like revenue (like how this ecommerce brand generated revenue), profitability ugcs, like brand awareness, so much. So this is something which is definitely like our eyeballs on it from the beginning of this year. I mean, we started last year, but now it's bigger tension there. Right? Yeah, you

Noah Rahimzadeh 08:43

probably probably have already seen some results from the end of last year going into this year that validate all of the things you just said. What's interesting is we you know, the podcast is called retention Chronicles. So we typically focus on the post sale side and our post acquisition side, I should say and how we grow existing, you know, existing customers. I'm curious for you, do you think of tick tock as a retention channel as well? Or is it really just to drive that first purchase? And then you want to move them over to the more traditional retention channels from there? Yeah, sure.

Anatoliy Labinskiy 09:20

So like for example, to the subject of today presentation to be actually Tiktok advertising and how we are analyzing that and how understand that Tiktok mentality in general, this is what we are using and we're important to understand the metrics and by that being said, like tick tock to compare with any other platform especially to compare with the bigger player meta. Definitely retention to like tick tock is a great platform to bring eyeballs into it and after that catch with the Google Shopping and with the meta Facebook retargeting campaigns (and how Meta ads compare to Amazon ads), but still like via we are getting retargeting from Tiktok quite a bit not that powerful as on Facebook, but like you should not sleep on it. I mean, all the platforms has to utilize all the power over it. And that's why like, just change a bit dangle make a bit more personalized messages and the retargeting ads will be working much, much better tick tock just protect the problems that it's less consistent. And to make it consistent and fast and profitable the time it requires unlimited creatives unlimited angles, unlimited approach to the creative side. So that's why like retargeting is working well, but they are not surviving for long if you want be updating the creatives again and again and want to continue speaking to your audience,

Noah Rahimzadeh 10:53

right. Okay,

Mariah Parsons 10:55

and it's only real quick before we dive into it. Is there any worry like with the consistency or the lack of consistency unless you have unlimited resources? That with tick tock, if anything happens to the platform, just because it's newer and some of the analytics or metrics that people are just now discovering, like tick tock shop, is there any worry from your side or the brands you're working with? That if you grow if you scale on tick tock and something happens to the platform, then you lose all that? Or is that really not a concern of yours? Ah,

Anatoliy Labinskiy 11:30

I would say I have no those kinds of concerns. First of all, tick tock is here and it won't go anywhere. Like it's done here. Like oh, look, I'm basically you know, Ukrainian poor living in Portugal has a company in Miami, in Florida. And when I'm visiting Miami when I'm visiting United States in general, people are not googling people are searching in Tik Tok, which is mind blowing for me. I've seen in myself as a diagnose our seriously when I see it, but fuck even searching for the restaurant they like go into Tik Tok, like what a joke. But yeah, it is a fact. So it won't go anywhere. I have no worries about that. Plus, we're important. Any kind of platform which you're using, make sure that all the pixels sit up on place from different platforms. So you will collect the data and IE if anything happened, which is like it will be mind blowing. But let's say something happened, restrictions going on or whatever, you're gonna be able to take your data and just utilize that on another platform since it all the pixels were on place. So that's just my opinion. In this way you protecting yourself plus, if they're speaking about active audience, which is we're leaving the data like emails, phone numbers. So obviously, money are staying all the profitability is on the email, SMS marketing. And like, if you want to run in the active SMS marketing campaigns, you're going to be just flipping on like over 30 person revenue on the table with no reason it's like very sold the profitability actually for every single brand. And the same people sell much easier than to someone new. So it's just simple.

Mariah Parsons 13:10

Love that answer. Thank you. Sure.

Noah Rahimzadeh 13:13

Yeah, let's, let's dive in. So in totally, I think you have a Tiktok related kind of use case that you wanted to talk through. And I'll let you go ahead and take over the screenshare. So for our YouTube audience, I can get some visuals. But yeah, just keep in mind that not everybody will watch on YouTube. So we'll try to explain as best as we can as we go through this for the people just listening on their preferred podcast channel.

Anatoliy Labinskiy 13:46

Oh, yeah, yeah, sure. So as I was saying, the subject, which is I want to share, it's our Tiktok strategies. It's not even the TIC tock strategy. So it's about our understanding of the logic of the TIC tock paid advertising platform as it is, since we realize how it works, what it requires, we stop seeing any kind of real problems to run ads there. So and we doing that already for about two years and since we like kind of cracked the system of the logic which does not exist in Tiktok, but repeatable steps are allowed you to stay like to stay on the way where you can keep the profitability and revenue going with the tick tock, that's definitely the subject which I want to speak about. So on this particular example, why like first of all, I would prefer to speak more about like maybe something more fun so like, tick tock show or something else, but I want to speak right now on this podcast about something what is 100% confident because Tiktok shop is still figuring it out. We like running around. I hate these kind of gurus you know, I'm gonna be like making my own one. Successful thinking, I'm gonna be like sharing like, I'm experimenting, I just want to share this particular part about the Facebook advertising of tick tock advertising platform since we've done that again and again, and especially on this particular example, which we done. Like, last year, it was a dropshipping store. So we have a client who is on the brand with us, and he just decided to test it out the dropshipping store with the TIC tock. And we made this kind of like challenge for ourselves. And the thing is that client is already in E commerce, he's so he is aware of how everything is working. And I believe this is the part of the success for this particular case. Because as you can see, on this screenshot, we started first two months, we were really playing around trying to reactivate the ad account, because that account getting shut down quite often when you run in dropshipping ads on the tick tock, and we'll see like, I highly recommend to use their agency accounts for tick tock, this is another thing which is very powerful like Facebook and tick tock on the agency account, so you won't have any kind of bond problems. But anyway, we were handling a lot of bond issues. And after that, when we figure it out, we start tasting final products and the store was related to the beauty nation health. So we find out the product which is related to the health niche, and helping 35 plus people to separate their blood in their legs. And that's products really were helpful useful when we got there. And those together was charged up together with the reviews on Amazon, like all the basics, marketing research we have done. And by end of January, as you can see, it started taking over and the like when we started seeing the performance, I will move out to the targeting and everything I realized, okay, this is something here and we we can move on on that direction and just try to push it with our understanding of the TIC tock logic. So really quick.

Noah Rahimzadeh 17:13

How does how does tic TOCs are getting compared to other platforms? Like metta?

Anatoliy Labinskiy 17:22

A good question. Look on this example here was a targeting, we have some cases where it was abroad. But I would say in the last 12 months we use in targeting so from the beginning, we didn't use any targets. But last 12 months, we like actively using targeting on Tik Tok because it became more common sense into the algorithms that like we can use it, we can utilize it before it was only broad. We tested out broad as well on the scaling. But most of the time we are starting with the broad niche targeting like it was in this case, which is I'm going to be sharing with you. Before we will move forward into into the exact metrics and KPIs which need to follow is tick tock, I want to explain how important is to understand the margin. This is guys to be honest, like as an agency owner, I have deal like this 100 sold the brand owners and people who are making even multiple, similar six figures a month sometimes come in and I'm asking like what's your margin? And they don't have an answer. And then that's the reality. I mean, there's not it's not a joke. It's sad, I would say it's funny, it's sad. It's like, I just started educating them. Okay, what's your AeroPress breakeven? They like? What do you mean? So that's the number one metrics which you have to understand before you spend any dollars on any kind of platform. Okay, so in this pro, that's why I want to describe this kind of metrics on product which will run in the we put the selling price 4995 for the product, where it was $11 cost of the purchase cost of the good plus shipping. So total $11 cost and our net margin means 3895. So 4995 minute minus cost. This is your net margin, which you can spend on ads $39, and it will be exactly your breakeven, if you get sale if you get sale lower than $39, then you are actually profitable. If it's above, you're actually losing money. So this is so you need to understand what's your CPE breakeven and it will be your lead margin which is $39 in our case, and breakeven arrow is how to calculate you just basically the move taking the price 4995 minus net margin it will be 2995 and actually sorry 4995 divided by 29 9528 95, so it will be your arrow as breakeven point, one point when he the lower number, the higher more possibilities, you have to be profitable, so then lower your iOS breakeven, then more chances that you're going to be highly profitable on your event. So like this product allowed us to put the right price was the good margin, or need so because it's delivers high value and serving, huge problem related to the house, so we can play around with the pricing easily. So our Berberich universe was 120. Remember those numbers because what I'm going to be sharing with you on the ad accounts, so like examples, you'll see why it's important to know, this kind of metrics. So basically, testing products at structure, one thing, which is you need to understand before following any kind of guidance mine or someone or someone else, especially like I'm an agency owner, so I have, like hundreds of ad accounts, which I have seen, which I'm seeing on daily basis, my media buyers are seen on daily basis. So I see all new I have on the vision of what's working, what's not working, if you're going to be listening, the brand owner who is handling one account one brand, it's hard to follow that one idea, because each ad account performing differently. What does it mean? So if for example, I'm sharing with you that we started testing with abo, maybe your ad account will be actually prefer more CBO for the test, and maybe a B cups has to start, you have to start as soon as possible. Like you need to understand your ad account quite quite well. This is what basically we starting with all the time. But when you start seeing the product taken off, we start testing our differences, the strategies on what kind of structure in AD account going to be working better, because the structure in an account is very important to find out what's working the best before scaling. On this account, we find out that smart campaigns were performing the best, but I will come to there. So we started here with 18 Plus targeting three ad sets by $30 Each so low, low budgets, one interest in each ad creative and set. As you can see, it's like health, lifestyle, health and wellness and hand and foot care. So three simple, highly related interest to the product, which is we are advertising it's like EMS massager, helping blood circulate in the blood. As I was saying, it's by the way, my mom, since three year old, we're working on the legs in the supermarket, so I know how painful it is. So we were handling that kind of like that kind of angles of pain and how to provide a solution to the pain quite easily. Because I have a good life example like what exactly the problem people are getting, what kind of solution by DCMS, we can provide for them. So that was quite easy to handle. And we like find out the different angles created our own ugcs to the product and start testing on a bill level campaign with ACO on. Option Acio allows you to test several variations of ad copies and creatives in the same minute in one single ad set. So we have three ad sets. And each set has 15 variation of the creatives. Whereas like five different ad copies with three different videos. They are just mixing up all with each other and it's giving you 15 individual unrepeatable variations of the creatives in each ad set which just allows you allows for you to tick tock to find out that particular variation of ad copy and video which is going to be algorithm crashed and push it to the audience. So these kinds of thing is crucial they will how you can test it like several creatives in one single ad set. Super simple, not expensive. And then the same time like not that big work needs to be done on the FIFO corpus which is short in the Tiktok it's not Facebook platform here is a short content needed and like five, three different video variations. And it's only a 15 unit creatives. So here

Noah Rahimzadeh 24:32

you might be listening to this but just tick tock make it very clear which variation which like variation works best or do you have to kind of go into the data yourself and figure that out.

Anatoliy Labinskiy 24:43

First of all, we start putting in much more particular variation Secondly, CTR on this is where it's going to be next slide. Very important on tick tock is the CTR matrix. It's going to be showing to you like oh this is particular things which just people loves. People want exactly These ad ad copy with this video. Okay, so the, this has helped you to like by reading the metrics you understand which creatives are actually taken over when you read on Tik Tok when the order metrics are high, and the lower metrics giving you bigger results, I mean, in terms of profitability, it's very rare. Usually all the metrics has to be high enough. And they in you're gonna be going in the same way profitable when the Tiktok or like, similar to Facebook, but it's more sensitive. Like if it started dropping a bit the CTR or like increasing their cost per click or something like that, you instantly start seeing fluctuation or in the, in the profitability. So the that's like so sensitive and so affected on your performance when you are not following the simple steps which I'm about to share. So like, as I was explaining this particular account, you can see on the screenshot, everything was on smart campaigns later on. So we find out that it's working, we just start duplicating to new campaigns, like basic, basic scaling strategies, three, three times publications is outperforming be like, Okay, let's duplicate with the bigger budget from 50 bucks to $100. And then let's play with the structures which is I was explaining in previous slides that what's the actual work in the best and we find out that actually Smart Campaign which just has no interest, it's completely broad. Within smart campaigns, you put it like several winning creatives, the more creatives and better but we prefer to not put more than four, it's like a golden mind for creatives three to four creatives to put in the Smart Campaign. So we have always testing creatives campaigns, structure campaign, testing product campaign, and testing interests, mostly on Facebook on tick tock, we don't go that much visit tested interest. So and because we have testing creatives campaigns, we filling up the Smart Campaign with the new creatives, which is gonna be like performing the most and putting them to the Smart Campaign and scaling them by duplications. So we duplicate in smart campaigns here, like by $100 $200 $300, we start playing around with the budget, which budget is going to be working actually the best for this particular ad account. So here like the before going deep into the strategies, metrics, which you need to be understanding on the tick tock, this is crucial. It's your MLS which we discussed one point we need to break even CTR, then higher than better minimum, I would say 1.3 not lower, whatever is lower, you need to look on your creatives, what's wrong with them, CPM for tick tock right now it's coming almost the same. So face Facebook, before it was less than $10. But I would say 10 $15, it's like quite a good metric for United States market for tier one countries, and CVR sold, how many people actually take an action and clicking on your ad and move into a store as well then higher number than better. And like CPA, this is the not like adolescent CPA, this is two things which is going to be keep you profitable, or you're gonna lose money. So you have to look on arrows and you have to look on the CPA. This is two crucial metrics from any, any other metrics to understand your profitability. So you remember, we have $39, the break even point for this product. And as you can see the CPA on all those campaigns were the highest is 35, but everything else during 2930 320-525-2526 34. So basically what we are doing, we, when we have breakeven $39 on the Tiktok, we definitely put extra 20% margin to put the rules to kill the campaign if it's going above the debt level. So basically, we tried to not spend on each campaign more than $3 per acquisition, so our CPA rule around storage $33, so we have extra seven to $9 living with us. And even if the campaign was sucks, we were still having around 15 20% profitability on the success campaigns, but the killers campaign which we were scaling and I will show you them on the next slides are like, usually on Tiktok is like double down from the CPA, if you see that something is doubled down of your CPA, so your CPA breakeven is to 29 and if your cost per purchase, your CPA is lower than 20. It means today, you're going to be scaling as hard as it can because it's highly profitable campaign for today. So that's about Tiktok. This is one one thing, which is people are saying, What's the difference between tick tock and Facebook? Tick tock has to be focused on today on yesterday and today? Yeah, Facebook, Facebook, you'll look on seven days, three days, someone's focused on the 30 days because it's more consistent platform Tiktok what was producing yesterday could be sucks today. Or what was sucks yesterday would be a banger today could be a winner. So that's the thing. That's why when we operate in a several campaigns in the same time, we put in for self, always this kind of extra dollars to CPA roll, lower than the breakeven, because we know that tomorrow that campaign could be actually sucks and because we're going to be stuck on believing in her from yesterday. Yeah, we believe in that this campaign actually producing from past week, we could lose money on that campaign. So that's why if you see that campaign, even the best one started going above $3 on particular breakeven 39, we're going to be just killing it a sub or or slowing down that budget or if we were scaling vertically, scaling vertically during the day we're going to be slow down the budget because that could really create the issues if you want follow so tick tock, it's all about media buying, I would say you know Papa master who is like controlling the needles, like it's exactly like who is media buyer on tick tock, this is like you playing with the budgets up and up and down, you are like killing the you killing the campaigns you turn on the campaigns, you are following the metrics like like it's almost 24 by seven needs to be done if you want to be on the high level skills on high level numbers with the campaign because such as all these campaigns, we're on almost $20,000 a day on that span. So we will move there one single campaigns. So when you when you doing that on the right way like you understanding the Tiktok you understand the metrics, okay, the way how to scale. Again, it depends on the ad account what Ad Account prefer is it duplication which is horizontal, is it vertical, which is like, very vertically scaling, budget, topping, PUT IT budget up during the day, or like combination doing all the same, but with the beat caps, and mid caps. Usually it's like in Facebook, giving you long term consistent performance in Tiktok is just giving you more possibilities to create more campaigns. Without so on for today. But But tomorrow, nobody gives you any kind of guarantees, unfortunately. So that's why when you are scaling. By duplications, we will duplicate in 510 times we were vertically scaling from 100 to 200. From 200 to 250. From 250 to 500. You need to see what's your CPA, how it looks like and how it looks like your your arrow s because when you start vertical, increasing the budget you like if you don't look on your CPA, you could lose profitability, instant profitability instantly, because like let's say, one of our winning campaigns, it's like $14 per purchase. And after that, we just like start scaling, it's still given us sales. But if you want to come CPA, you want to recognize that now your cost per acquisition, not $15 your CPA actually showed in dollars. So it just grow it just you now have a bigger budget. It's still getting sales and it will looks like great but uncertainty if you're not following the simple metric of CPU understanding you want understand that? Hey, man, like you started actually losing money, you just like getting purchases for more higher price doesn't make sense. But when you see that you have to decrease the budget or even turn off the campaign for today. And after midnight, turn it on back on a regional budget. So the main thing about the TIC tock what was working yesterday doesn't work today and opposite. Because of that. When you scale to let's say from 100 to 500. Vertically, you need to return the original budget from after midnight. So you started off on hundreds and scale to 500 make sure that tomorrow started from 100 the same winning campaign, because if you don't live on 500 level like you could do on Facebook, you're going to be most probably losing money from first minute on the TIC tock on the next day after midnight. That's why we're important like a purple monster always playing with the budgets and the like from midnight. Add to the return your initial budget back as it was on the previous day. And that's like, Okay, how I will scale in that case? Yes. Okay, I have a bunch of complaints of 100 bucks, how will they scale to 1000 or $10,000? A day on adspend. That's why you have to play with the different budgets. So that's why you have to play with the different budgets, when you're duplicating like three, five times, you have to start if it's already proven that duplications are working, you have to start like, Okay, this campaign was five times duplicate it 100 bucks. Let's see what else working in this ad account. Maybe this will be we know that 150 bucks are working, let's find out what else is working. So with this out 200 300 In five time duplication, one campaign, it's 201. Time is 301, time 401, Time 501 Time 600. And checking out which of the budgets will be produced well, as well. And you know what, most of the time four or five are actually sucks. And we find out that actually $400 are working well, and everything else doesn't work. So like, wow, okay, now we have initial budget of the day $400 from from nowadays. And now we can scale not from 100 to 500. During the day, we can actually increase the budget during the day from 400 to 1000. And we already like having like, higher, higher ad spend. And like by fooling the matrix, we understanding that we are highly profitable, and we can push forward that budget. And that's why like if you see that your CPA is high, and your profitability is high as well at the beginning of the day, and you have like initial budgets already, you know, candidate 400, and you have bunch of 400 campaigns, find out one, which is like delivering the most and just scale that hard to 1k a day at least, and maybe even above and don't stop scaling budget, vertical scaling has to be stopped. But after 3pm If you're going to be continued increasing after 3pm on Tiktok. Most of the time, if you're if your ad account the same as your timezone or their store, most of the time you're gonna be start losing your profitability, the biggest push has to be in the morning. And as well, there is one metric which I didn't speak about is the level of profitability in the morning, which you have to follow before scaling or killing some if you see that your day starts in 25 to 30 person plus profitability by 5am, then today's going to be scaling day to day you're going to be pushing hard. But if you see that your day started sucks, like 2018 14% profitability, then you're gonna be these days need just to survive. So you won't be scaling, you're gonna just like killing on time, the down downgrade the budgets, whatever needed, powers, the losers, and next day trying those losers again, maybe it will work again. So these were important for you to always use the platforms for example, like true profit, it's not affiliate nothing. I'm just saying what we are using. So true profit app, which is supposed to be on separate tab open in front of you all our media buyers looking on the true profit before making judgments on that account. So true profit is showing that okay, we have profitability right now, 14 person, we won't be scaling today. We have profitability 27? Yes, let's find out what's campaign producing the most, and scale that baby vertically during the date and duplications which were made yesterday, we're going to be killing the losers and leaving the winners. And this is about like, scaling harder, you can you're testing out different budgets. And as well. When you are let's say find out 400. Now you have to test it out five times. So bigger budgets 800 600 800,000 1000 200,000 6400. Find out which is working, we find out the $1,000 budget is working well. And now use your initial budget. On the next days, we will be starting with couple of campaigns $1,000. And you can vertically scale. And this is where we will get in one campaign from like 1000 to five 7001 single campaign up to like over $10,000 in in the daily spend. And basically we have like let's say 2040 campaigns running and during the day only one or two leaving. So during day we just clean in all the bad stuff according to the metrics and leaving just one or two running and scaling that heart until we can basically up to 3pm if it's still showing low CPU and tired OS and we just like seen performance over like 20 30k a day easily with the Tiktok ads on lot, but it could be great day. But tomorrow, everything could die off without any kind of return. And to avoid that, you need something what I mentioned 10 minutes ago, separate campaign of creative testings. This is all about tick tock in other point. Even Facebook very important creatives in our days, but tick tock, it's all about creatives on it. So if you want to feed it with the new variations of the creatives, which is working, let's say you find out creatives which are working, you taking them off and send it to your video editor and saying, Listen, this way these angles are working, I want you to make a serie variations of these creatives with the same angle, more, at least sonically variations plus you just see department I need more angles like that. So you get you're supposed to get more and more creatives every single week, we when you're like less than $1,000 a day $1,000 A day in revenue, you can test like five creative Civic, that will be fine, you will be okay. But when you scan in, like I described to you like 1000s Starting budget 10,000 a day, one campaign it will be dying off in every three days, really it will be dying off all the creatives tick tock never let creatives be alive for long. So that's why the creative testing campaign has to take always up to 20% of your daily budget up to 20 person, you have to test it bunch of the creative. So if you're doing 1000 a day, you have to test at least five a week. If you're doing revenue in 10 20,000 a day, the 1010 20,000 a day, then you have to test at least 20 or even 40 creatives Eric, this is where you will be seeing the consistency on the desktop side. Otherwise, you will have spike of incredible day and after that week, it will be like that. And after that, again, spike of the day. And this is how it is. And if you want to see the straight line on the Tiktok you need to fill it up with the creatives. And this is the only one thing how you can allow your ads be profitable and consistent, profitable by working on metrics, and consistent by filling up with the new variations of the winning variation creatives. And as well separated tested out the new angles. Who knows which angle we will perform as well. So basically, like as I was explaining that like here, for example, it's like our campaigns which is we're usually staying at the end. And like all you see everything is skilled only one campaign stain and white stain, and we were pushing it really hard like two weeks, three weeks, then 1k 2k 5k 10k the budget and why and for what metrics we're seeing. We were seeing that CPC super cheap CPM is okay. CTR is good. Still a creative is like your life, if creative. This other thing when you scale and start seeing that you scale and then UCPA going higher and higher. And nothing is like working day by day. Always check on your CTR, most probably your CTR is started going down to compare to other days, it means your creatives start dying. This is the metric where you will feel that creative is dying or no, it's your CTR. So that's why you need to feed up with the new creatives, new winning creatives, your campaigns and continue scaling and your CTR will be again, okay, there'll be growing and looking on your CPA. So this is one of the banger campaigns. So you remember our breakeven is 39. And we get in sales for 1448. He just insanely highly profitable around 60% profitability campaign. And obviously we were pushing it double with double double the budget during the day, if the CPA will be hired electorate to for example, we will be sort of start slowing down the budgets and seeing how it works. But since it didn't work, like you remember, we have a roll up to 33 hours to kill. We just killed that campaign. And that's all for today. And tomorrow we just launch it again and chicken out how it would produce on the original buyer budget how to produce the results again to us so basically, it's the main things about that and like if they if the campaigns are not producing quite well we just trimming the budgets or killing them if they're sucks we killing them. If they're just okay and you try to push the that doesn't work and you redistribute and it's the it's just giving you okay like 25 bucks, let's say cost per acquisition. We just keep in our cities and let them go till the end of the day. But the bangers which scaling hard and making sure that every single day creative testings campaigns are going active and spending at least 10 to 20 percent of the budget, usually like you have to put 20% budget on the testing phase of the creatives testing of the structure of the components and sometimes offers when you see that offers tight not dying off. Here is another thing, which is in the 20% of your daily budgets has to be always implemented, tested out different landing pages with different offers, but it's another subject, I don't want to go too deep. But this is basically metrics, which you need to understand and follow the KPIs to follow by following those KPIs, you're able to run profitable and consistent Tiktok advertising. And this working for us quite well for quite long. And we stick talk shop advertising, because Tiktok shop can be actually advertised right now. And like now we want to implement all the strategies for Tiktok shop and see if it will be produced the same, or even maybe better results than on Shopify. That's another thing, which we're gonna be diving in and implementing exactly the same logic to the Tiktok shop itself and see how that will produce. But that was the basic way level of the management or the tip dockets. And we were able from zero to 275,000, scaled in less than 60 days. And like highly profitable results. I mean, that moment, it was 23.4% net margin, where we generated $64,000, in less than 60 days. 60 days for the client with no past data with no email marketing, just tick tock retargeting was there, but only 5% Just a bit. And as I was saying he was like dying, and we launched a new diet, and we're launching you. But the main point was to find out the structure, which is smart campaigns, find out what's working, the best duplication of vertical scaling, get the initial budget as high as possible. Because it doesn't mean if it's 400, producing the 1000 Euro produce, you need to test it out different letters of the budgets and find out which one could be 900, yours in your account could be my 1000. on your end, it could be 900 950, you need to find out that sweet spot. And then when you find out what's working the best to the ad account to the algorithm on this particular account. You can scale further and tested more and more things and playing around with up and down budgets according to Kritis and metrics, which you have to your product, your breakeven margin, your CP breakeven and arrow s that will show you like how well you're moving during day and this screenshot, by the way from the true prophet tab. So basically this kind of app, it's usually on the second tab for media buyer. And he's just like, making adjustments according to the numbers which he's seen for particular day on total profit.

Noah Rahimzadeh 47:58

Wow. So much. They're really appreciate you running us through that. And I have so many questions, but I have a hard stop in a minute. So my big takeaway too is, you know, the whole what worked today might not work tomorrow or what didn't work today might work tomorrow, right. So I think that's really important. It's a really interesting distinction between the other between the other ad channels that our listeners should take away as well. And since we're at time mentally again, thank you so much. Where can our listeners find you if they want to if they want to connect or learn more, especially as you you know, think about how tic tock shops can enhance or or change what you just walked through?

Anatoliy Labinskiy 48:45

Yeah, sure. Well, basically I'm personally replying in DMS and Instagram. This is number one part from where I am. It's equal by Anatoly and I totally Lubinski Instagram page and plus like we have free content on our YouTube a lot of case studies, Facebook, Tik Tok, email, SMS marketing, and it's Anatoly Verbinski YouTube channel, you can have a look a lot of free valuable content for you there. And our website Jason Bros. agency.com, where you can just scroll down and see all the past data our team members with photos with everything there so you can see that who we are and how long we are on the market. Awesome.

Noah Rahimzadeh 49:25

All right, and I totally thank you so much, man, Mariah, thanks as always, we'll talk soon